Linn Owners

Signs of a Kandid wearing out

Daveyf

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Ok, thanks for confirming that I didn‘t miss anything 😀.

People with Urika 2 who want use Exakt have no other option.

And yes, I compared Urika 1 with other phono stages and a few of them were very impressive. Bevor replacing the real phono stage (😜) Urika 1 with another real phono stage, I‘ll try Utopik in the Radikal 2.

When will you jump in the real phono stage world and what would you recommend?
I'm putting you on permanent ignore, I suggest you do the same thing for me.
 

Daveyf

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llatpoh said:
"I wouldn't worry to much about it though, if your cartridge is properly adjusted (VTF, VTA, Azimuth) record damage is unlikely, styluses become dull as they wear, not sharper, your ears will likely hurt before your records do."

I'm sorry but this is incorrect. I have examined hundreds, if not thousands, of styli under the microscope and the wear pattern can definitely damage your records. As the stylus wears the contact patch, which starts out rounded, develops flat spots. The more it wears the larger the flat spots become. One of the techniques used to measure the amount of wear is to rotate the stylus carrier until the patch of light on the flat spot becomes a thin line and see how many degrees of rotation is needed for that to happen, giving you an idea of how broad the flat spot has gotten. The edges of those flat spots are sharp and when the spot gets quite wide it can and will damage your records. We refer to particularly badly worn styli as VMCDs - Vinyl Munching Chisels of Death! When a stylus reaches that point you are wearing the high frequencies off the record. Done badly enough it can basically engrave the distortion into the groove.

One telltale is when you notice an increase in distorted sibilants in the inner grooves - sung "S" sounds, cymbal hits, etc. The inner grooves are where they are the most difficult to track so you will notice it there first. If those sibilants sound splashy and distorted it is definitely time to get the stylus checked and likely replaced.
Excellent points. There are folks all over the web who believe that stylus do not wear to the point that your vinyl will be damaged.
I have been told by folks on various audio forums that even the badly worn stylus will not really damage your vinyl. Yet, when i alert folks that a severely worn stylus can damage your LP with just one play, I am usually not believed. One thing i try and do...is to try to remember to NEVER buy any records from these folks.
Vinyl Munching Chisel of Death is 100% correct, but try and tell folks this!
 
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llatpoh

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Excellent points. There are folks all over the web who believe that stylus do not wear to the point that your vinyl will be damaged.
I have been told by folks on various audio forums that even the badly worn stylus will not really damage your vinyl. Yet, when i alert folks that a severely worn stylus can damage your LP with just one play, I am usually not believed. One thing i try and do...is to try to remember to NEVER buy any records from these folks.
Vinyl Munching Chisel of Death is 100% correct, but try and tell folks this!
With a properly adjusted cartridge and in a highly resolving system, audible degradation will set in long before record damage, making the point moot for the most part.
 

akamatsu

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With a properly adjusted cartridge and in a highly resolving system, audible degradation will set in long before record damage, making the point moot for the most part.
And for a not so highly resolving system, I would expect a MM cartridge for which the stylus can be changed easily and inexpensively. As you mentioned earlier, a scheduled replacement scheme would work well and provide much peace of mind.
 

ThomasOK

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You would be surprised at some of the styli that come through here. VMCDs that have two very wide and sharp flat spots that are so big they come together at the very tip in a thin line instead of a rounded point. This has happened with expensive cartridges from high quality systems as well as with cheap ones from basic systems. I have found that some try to squeeze more life out of their expensive cartridges than is wise. The fact that the degradation is mostly gradual allows people to overlook that it is happening, sometimes until well after the "use by" date has passed. We always recommend when in doubt that our customers bring in their stylus or cartridge (or the turntable and we'll remove and reinstall it) for a check under the microscope (a stereo, lighted, high-magnification Wild-Heerbrugg unit specifically chosen for the purpose). While some take this to the extreme (one woman brings her stylus in once a month) we still happily check them for no charge.
 

13th Duke of Wymbourne

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The purist would use a mono microscope 😀

But, seriously, what magnification is required? I have access to microscopes at work and want to figure out if they will be up to the job before removing my cartridge.
 

akamatsu

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a stereo, lighted, high-magnification Wild-Heerbrugg unit specifically chosen for the purpose
Fitted with a camera and sharing photos here would be helpful. :)
Perhaps a new stylus and examples at various stages of wear.

My Krystal was placed under a microscope at Definitive Audio in Seattle. It was interesting, but I really didn't know what I was looking at as didn't know what it looked like new for comparison. Ron the fettler said "The good news is you play a lot of records." This was at about 3.5 years of age.
 
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ThomasOK

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The purist would use a mono microscope 😀

But, seriously, what magnification is required? I have access to microscopes at work and want to figure out if they will be up to the job before removing my cartridge.
Only for mono cartridges! ;)

The version of the microscope we have at the store uses 10x eyepieces and a 2.0x additional objective lens along with a ring with settings of 6/12/25/50. According to their chart that gives a maximum of 100x magnification when the ring is at 50. Settings of 12 and 25 are useful to look at the entire diamond and cantilever, also to inspect the coils on MCs where they are visible, etc. The 50 setting is the one needed to really be able to see the quality of the tip itself.

The one I have at home is a little different model with different numbers but has a maximum magnification of 120x. It was a custom version put together for Audio Technica and sold to their dealers that I managed to pick up off eBay at a good price and is very clean.
 

Nestor Turton

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The purist would use a mono microscope 😀
With a linear power supply, of course, and mega expensive mains cable for greater focus. I know some may say it makes no difference, but have they tried?

After all in the days of dial-up, some doubted a reviewer’s report that when he put a Russ Andrews lead on his modem it sped up his internet access.

And me, I beiieve an Ekstatik would sound better than my current Krystal ….
 
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pirov

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While not wanting to badmouth Lyra either, I do suspect that they have ongoing QC issues. I have heard many stories of misaligned cantilevers, even experiencing this myself. Luckily, their dealer network stands behind the product, but still….
I've never had any cantilever misalignment issues with Lyra Delos, Kleos, Kleos SL, or now with Etna SL. I've always adjusted anti-skate according to Lyra's manual, and not by the dial on the Ekos SE which I think applies too much compensating force.

"Anti-skating. Carefully adjust anti-skating force by observing the stylus and cantilever directly (as seen from the front of the cartridge) when the stylus is lowered into a record groove. Any pulling of the cantilever toward the left or right means the setting is wrong. Readjust repeatedly until the antiskating force leaves the cantilever centered. It is better to do this adjustment visually as described above, rather than relying on the number-scales built into your tonearm or blank-groove test records."
 
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sktn77a

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ThomasOK

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Interesting article. Makes sense at an intuitive level but, objectively, how can you make assertions like "hiss, or groove noise, is not caused by friction........................but primarily it is caused by stylus jitter" without some sort of supporting data/proof?
How can you make assertions...without...proof? Apparently you aren't familiar with politicians, nor stock analysts.
 

akamatsu

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Interesting article. Makes sense at an intuitive level but, objectively, how can you make assertions like "hiss, or groove noise, is not caused by friction........................but primarily it is caused by stylus jitter" without some sort of supporting data/proof?

Agreed that it's better to support assertions with some sort of evidence. But his assertion would capture the data that the Radikal reduces record surface noise, something I had been scratching my head over for a quite a while.
 

sktn77a

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Well, you can hear or measure surface noise. But how can you distinguish noise caused by friction vs noise caused by jitter?
 
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