Domestic compromises and low level listening

Lawrence001

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Do these mobile phone apps have some way of calibrating the measurement as I can see a lot of variation between brands and models?

FWIW I've been listening at relatively low levels for years, I've lived in semi detached houses/terraces/flats since I was 18 (initially shared like most) although I didn't care much about bothering others when I was younger unless they asked me to turn it down.

I now tend to listen most at about 10-midnight after the kids are asleep. I'm lucky the current house neighbours have a loft extension so they are 2 floors up at bedtime and I can turn it up a little bit louder than otherwise. The long term plan is to buy a detached house or a so-called "halls adjoining" semi so I can turn it up a bit more at any time of day or night without worrying about the neighbours.
 
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enrae8

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Do these mobile phone apps have some way of calibrating the measurement as I can see a lot of variation between brands and models?

FWIW I've been listening at relatively low levels for years, I've lived in semi detached houses/terraces/flats since I was 18 (initially shared like most) although I didn't care much about bothering others when I was younger unless they asked me to turn it down.

I now tend to listen most at about 10-midnight after the kids are asleep. I'm lucky the current house neighbours have a loft extension so they are 2 floors up at bedtime and I can turn it up a little bit louder than otherwise. The long term plan is to buy a detached house or a so-called "halls adjoining" semi so I can turn it up a bit more at any time of day or night without worrying about the neighbours.
Oooh Lawerence - didn’t recognise you - you’ve gone all purple!
 
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hificricketboy

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Do these mobile phone apps have some way of calibrating the measurement as I can see a lot of variation between brands and models?

FWIW I've been listening at relatively low levels for years, I've lived in semi detached houses/terraces/flats since I was 18 (initially shared like most) although I didn't care much about bothering others when I was younger unless they asked me to turn it down.

I now tend to listen most at about 10-midnight after the kids are asleep. I'm lucky the current house neighbours have a loft extension so they are 2 floors up at bedtime and I can turn it up a little bit louder than otherwise. The long term plan is to buy a detached house or a so-called "halls adjoining" semi so I can turn it up a bit more at any time of day or night without worrying about the neighbours.
We had a detached house for a few years and noise was no issue. When we moved to our current house it was a prerequisite that there was a hallway between us and next door if we couldn't get another detached house.

Here late night listening was always low volume with kids rooms above the lounge. Now both kids are gone the restrictions have been reduced a fair bit. But the restrictions are now in room; her ears and my ears.
 

peter the butcher

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A couple of recent posts have made me think about listening volume plus amp and speaker "activation" point.

Due to domestic compromises I tend to listen to music at relatively low levels; 60 dB peak is not uncommon. When alone I do tend to turn the volume up a bit but for extended listening the peaks are really not much above 75 dB. This has driven me (rightly or wrongly) towards a high sensitivity system. My thinking was that sensitive speakers will open up at lower volumes. This leads me to choose low output valve amps which tbh sound great.

So my current Border Patrol 300B SE drives my Living Voice OBX-R2s well. But it still sounds to me that the "activation" volume is around 70 dB (all volumes measured by a phone app).

My listening position is also somewhat compromised by having the speakers firing down one leg of an L shaped room. Hopefully the photo captures this (I was watching the cricket! ).

So where do I go from here?

Are my ideas about speakers and amps having a point where they start to "work" correct? And do sensitive speakers work sooner as the volume is turned up?

Should I be looking for more (!) sensitive speakers to make the most of my compromises? And if so, what are the options?

All views welcome.

HCB.
I am in a similar situation, as other half "puts up with it", so 99% of the time its all played quiet... until she goes out, then up the volume quite a bit, and get the subs to work as they should with proper Hz, not artificial low sounds (organ music) ha ha ha
 
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BalooToo

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Do these mobile phone apps have some way of calibrating the measurement as I can see a lot of variation between brands and models?
I am guessing that the microphone in each make of phone is different and so even if two people are using the same app the results would not be the same. I have been trying to think of a common source in a house that everyone has but I cannot think of anything.

My hearing is shot by to many miles on a motorcycle without hearing protection so it is unlikely I can hear better than anyone else. I still think it depends a lot on the music your listening too. Adele at 60db would be quite acceptable but Deep Purple sounds awful to me.
 

StingRay

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I am guessing that the microphone in each make of phone is different and so even if two people are using the same app the results would not be the same. I have been trying to think of a common source in a house that everyone has but I cannot think of anything.

My hearing is shot by to many miles on a motorcycle without hearing protection so it is unlikely I can hear better than anyone else. I still think it depends a lot on the music your listening too. Adele at 60db would be quite acceptable but Deep Purple sounds awful to me.
Do you mean Deep Purple needs to played louder?
 

Non-Smoking Man

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You should use a TVC passive for your pre amp - see 6 Moons Audio review of the Stereoknight TVC for explanation.
Para 4..'with a 300pf cable...'

Jack NSM
 
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hificricketboy

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You should use a TVC passive for your pre amp - see 6 Moons Audio review of the Stereoknight TVC for explanation.
Para 4..'with a 300pf cable...'

Jack NSM
Thanks Jack. Just read the article. Is that real?

I've never had a passive pre amp, in fact I've only had the EAR 802 and SJS Arcadia...
 

Non-Smoking Man

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Ive got the Django, Schitt Saga, and Alpha2Delta Pre1 and Ive had the MFA Baby Pre and Prometheus. Plus I have listened to to a fully differentially balanced ss pre very recently (but not in the context of your problem).
'Real'? Real enough ..I'm trying the idea out at the moment.
Mind you I rate your kit so careful consideration needed..?

Jack
 
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This boy can wait

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I'm in exactly the same position as the OP, listening late at night and at low volumes. Having just moved house and with a bigger room, I'd lost some of the body and bass to the sound coming from my Sugden A21a and Proac D15s.

Following advice from MotherSky and TIU on the Proac thread, I added a Rel subwoofer and have been astonished by the results. It's added weight and scale to the presentation at all listening levels, way, way above the crossover frequency, which I have set to 30-40 Hz. Imaging is also improved - I don't know how this is all working but I like it.

Using the app Decibel X, the background in my room, without music playing is 25 dB, measured at my listening position. I'm listening at an average of 40-50 dB across a range of material and it sounds great.

As has been mentioned by several posters here, adding a sub can work very well.

Stef
 

hificricketboy

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OK, I've been playing with speaker positioning and volume control.

I've brought the speakers out into the room and the right hand speaker in from the wall. Slight improvement and then brought the left speaker more central to avoid any "shadowing" from a sofa and it has improved again but still not "right".

My Aries G1 has the option of enabling digital (software) volume control. So... limiting the Aries output to 50 means I have to move the volume on my SJS from 7 o'clock to about 12 o'clock to give the same SPL. There's a noticeable improvement in imaging and dynamics. There's even a bit of feeling to the bass when at 60dB.

I need to keep tinkering and fettling but it does appear that attenuating the signal and then driving the pre and power amps a little harder has brought improvement.

Any thoughts?
 

hearhere

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OK, I've been playing with speaker positioning and volume control.

Any thoughts?
Do I spy a sub in your system? If so, I suggest you disconnect it and concentrate on getting your main speakers set up for best sound. Toe-in is often a big influence on imaging and needs to be exactly right. Tilt can sometimes improve matters. These are easy to experiment with, as is distance from rear and side walls. Another big influence over the sound can be the choice of feet for the speakers. Spikes are not necessarily ideal. You seem to have carpeting with a plate or tile under your speakers but have spikes between the speakers and the plate. It may improve matters if you went the isolation route by fitting your speakers with IsoAcoustic Gaias or similar and stand these on Gaia carpet spikes. Although my flooring is very different from yours, my switch from spikes onto a stone slab to Gaias directly onto my solid wood-on-concrete flooring made a significant improvement, particularly in the bass. The detail was greatly increased so individual instruments could be more easily identified and the sound became more realistic. However the bass volume won't increase with Gaias.

Only when you have exceptional sound from your main speakers should you look at the sub problem. Subs are a problem as they usually overlap a big chunk of frequencies with what your main speakers are trying to deliver. Some modern amps allow you to cut off the main speaker output frequency to match your subs, but most don't. Placement of the sub is important too and you may find it better to place it well away from your main speakers, but it all needs time spent experimenting. Don't allow your subs to over-dominate - keep its volume as low as it needs to be to "fill in" where your main speakers are deficient. Finally don’t be tempted to give up and resort to room correction DSP to sort out your sub problems. This may give an initial impression of job done, but it will be at a cost in the excitement factor that I’m sure you are striving for.
 

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