Smokestack

"Audiophile Vinyl " my foot !

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Problem is that some charity shops which used to be a great source of 2nd hand buys are not only charging more, but for records that are frankly not in great nick.
But that makes it all the more rewarding when that treasure is found for a decent price I suppose. It's why I got into records in the first place all those years ago - the thrill of the chase!!! 
I agree,
Charity shops (in my neck of the woods at least) are a waste of time now, they seem to have record cleaners but don't care whether the record is worth cleaning. A pity as I got many excellent and often apparently unplayed classical records from them over the years.

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Everyone thinks an LP from the 50/60/70's is worth a fortune these days. 

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My lad gets all his music on vinyl (bands such as All time Low, Gates. You me at 6 and a host of others) to date you can pick holes in some production but overall the vinyl is pretty much noiseless and far more consistent in quality than LPs from the 80s.

Even in my hay day of buying vinyl in the 70s pressings were pretty much hit and miss .. I gave up on Yellow Brick Road after my local record shop had got in the third copy and it was still popping and ticking all over the place (even on the fairly mediocre replay stuff in the shop).

I have bought a number of pressings in recent years (40th Edition Crime of the Century, replaced Sgt Pepper, Genesis Foxtrot and Nursery Cryme, Roger Walters stuff and others) and overall I have been very pleased with the quality (although the original mixes of Foxtrot and Nursery Cryme is not as good as the original).

I clean a record and replace the sleeve for my stuff before playing it (as I have found dust contamination on some new records in the past).  So if you are serious about your vinyl get a decent record cleaner (I use an Okki Nokki).

I am one of those of the opinion that a modern digital recording should sound as good if not better on CD.  However my 22 year old lad has some of his material (mostly all new and digital recordings) on CD but will invariably play the vinyl version which he says sounds better.  He is not a hifi buff but he says that there is a realism about vinyl that just isn't there on CD and he has absolutely no axe to grind.  He uses my system (he knows sod all about turntables arms and cartridges) but in case he buys a house I bought a Linn on ebay the other day for not a lot of money, with a mission arm mount still left on it - so I can just slot in my spare Mission 774 arm and I must get my other Decca Retipped and he is ready to go (I have a pair of time windows in the garage and I have two spare haflers and a hafler preamp and an elite preamp .. now for a 22 year old that is one hell of a first system methinks) as he would be lost without vinyl replay.

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3 hours ago, bencat said:

Sadly I can get decent CD's for very little money and with a huge range of music and none of the limitations of Vinyl Sound so think given the added cost for equipment ,Lp's and the limited catalogue available plus the effort to research to find out if the pressing / mastering / recording is good will stick to what I know and like and give Vinyl the thumbs down .

On many occasions now quite a bit of what is available on CD is very compressed and very loud. There is as much a available on Vinyl now as CD as I said used is the way to go. Research into what is a quality CD can be more difficult. There is a reason the worlds top mastering engineers prefer vinyl to digital cd.

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2 hours ago, Baggawire said:

I agree that there a many great pressings out there but they cost many great pounds.

I was in HMV and loads of stuff for around £10?

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Audiophile Vinyl pressed on 180g vinyl mastered from the original mastertapes is a lie ! Unless from a True Audiophile label

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/11/magazine/universal-fire-master-recordings.html

The list of destroyed album masters includes
recordings by Benny Goodman, Cab Calloway, the Andrews Sisters, the Ink Spots, the Mills Brothers, Lionel Hampton, Ray Charles, Sister Rosetta Tharpe, Clara Ward, Sammy Davis Jr., Les Paul, Fats Domino, Big Mama Thornton, Burl Ives, the Weavers, Kitty Wells, Ernest Tubb, Lefty Frizzell, Loretta Lynn, George Jones, Merle Haggard, Bobby (Blue) Bland, B.B. King, Ike Turner, the Four Tops, Quincy Jones, Burt Bacharach, Joan Baez, Neil Diamond, Sonny and Cher, the Mamas and the Papas, Joni Mitchell, Captain Beefheart, Cat Stevens, the Carpenters, Gladys Knight and the Pips, Al Green, the Flying Burrito Brothers, Elton John, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Eric Clapton, Jimmy Buffett, the Eagles, Don Henley, Aerosmith, Steely Dan, Iggy Pop, Rufus and Chaka Khan, Barry White, Patti LaBelle, Yoko Ono, Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers, the Police, Sting, George Strait, Steve Earle, R.E.M., Janet Jackson, Eric B. and Rakim, New Edition, Bobby Brown, Guns N’ Roses, Queen Latifah, Mary J. Blige, Sonic Youth, No Doubt, Nine Inch Nails, Snoop Dogg, Nirvana, Soundgarden, Hole, Beck, Sheryl Crow, Tupac Shakur, Eminem, 50 Cent and the Roots

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Posted (edited)

I read that story about  the Universal fire a few days ago .

Very sad ...and what amounted to a 10 year cover up is scandalous !

You can rebuild a cathedral... but you can't ask Chuck Berry or Ella Fitzgerald to pop back in the room and do another take.

[I remember a few years ago reading that members of Steely Dan were looking to put out some re-issues and were told that the analogue  masters "seemed to be missing".

Universal knew exactly where  they were...up in smoke .]

Record Companies of course , being essentially short sighted  commercial organisations, are perfectly happy so long as they have a set of flat digital transfers...which for most of it they probably do .   But that's not the point .

Edited by Smokestack

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5 hours ago, triumph said:

Audiophile Vinyl pressed on 180g vinyl mastered from the original mastertapes is a lie ! Unless from a True Audiophile label

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/11/magazine/universal-fire-master-recordings.html

The list of destroyed album masters includes
recordings by Benny Goodman, Cab Calloway, the Andrews Sisters, the Ink Spots, the Mills Brothers, Lionel Hampton, Ray Charles, Sister Rosetta Tharpe, Clara Ward, Sammy Davis Jr., Les Paul, Fats Domino, Big Mama Thornton, Burl Ives, the Weavers, Kitty Wells, Ernest Tubb, Lefty Frizzell, Loretta Lynn, George Jones, Merle Haggard, Bobby (Blue) Bland, B.B. King, Ike Turner, the Four Tops, Quincy Jones, Burt Bacharach, Joan Baez, Neil Diamond, Sonny and Cher, the Mamas and the Papas, Joni Mitchell, Captain Beefheart, Cat Stevens, the Carpenters, Gladys Knight and the Pips, Al Green, the Flying Burrito Brothers, Elton John, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Eric Clapton, Jimmy Buffett, the Eagles, Don Henley, Aerosmith, Steely Dan, Iggy Pop, Rufus and Chaka Khan, Barry White, Patti LaBelle, Yoko Ono, Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers, the Police, Sting, George Strait, Steve Earle, R.E.M., Janet Jackson, Eric B. and Rakim, New Edition, Bobby Brown, Guns N’ Roses, Queen Latifah, Mary J. Blige, Sonic Youth, No Doubt, Nine Inch Nails, Snoop Dogg, Nirvana, Soundgarden, Hole, Beck, Sheryl Crow, Tupac Shakur, Eminem, 50 Cent and the Roots

I go off sound quality and much of what has been released on Vinyl over recent years sounds superb........not the same with CD I am afraid.

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5 hours ago, triumph said:

Audiophile Vinyl pressed on 180g vinyl mastered from the original mastertapes is a lie ! Unless from a True Audiophile label

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/11/magazine/universal-fire-master-recordings.html

The list of destroyed album masters includes
recordings by Benny Goodman, Cab Calloway, the Andrews Sisters, the Ink Spots, the Mills Brothers, Lionel Hampton, Ray Charles, Sister Rosetta Tharpe, Clara Ward, Sammy Davis Jr., Les Paul, Fats Domino, Big Mama Thornton, Burl Ives, the Weavers, Kitty Wells, Ernest Tubb, Lefty Frizzell, Loretta Lynn, George Jones, Merle Haggard, Bobby (Blue) Bland, B.B. King, Ike Turner, the Four Tops, Quincy Jones, Burt Bacharach, Joan Baez, Neil Diamond, Sonny and Cher, the Mamas and the Papas, Joni Mitchell, Captain Beefheart, Cat Stevens, the Carpenters, Gladys Knight and the Pips, Al Green, the Flying Burrito Brothers, Elton John, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Eric Clapton, Jimmy Buffett, the Eagles, Don Henley, Aerosmith, Steely Dan, Iggy Pop, Rufus and Chaka Khan, Barry White, Patti LaBelle, Yoko Ono, Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers, the Police, Sting, George Strait, Steve Earle, R.E.M., Janet Jackson, Eric B. and Rakim, New Edition, Bobby Brown, Guns N’ Roses, Queen Latifah, Mary J. Blige, Sonic Youth, No Doubt, Nine Inch Nails, Snoop Dogg, Nirvana, Soundgarden, Hole, Beck, Sheryl Crow, Tupac Shakur, Eminem, 50 Cent and the Roots

Sorry mate that is Bollox.

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Posted (edited)

The real number, he surmises, was “in the 175,000 range.” If you extrapolate from either figure, tallying songs on album and singles masters, the number of destroyed recordings stretches into the hundreds of thousands. In another confidential report, issued later in 2009, UMG asserted that “an estimated 500,000 song titles” were lost.

A master is a one-of-a-kind artifact, the irreplaceable primary source of a piece of recorded music. According to UMG documents, the vault held analog tape masters dating back as far as the late 1940s, as well as digital masters of more recent vintage. It held multitrack recordings, the raw recorded materials — each part still isolated, the drums and keyboards and strings on separate but adjacent areas of tape — from which mixed or “flat” analog masters are usually assembled. And it held session masters, recordings that were never commercially released.

The monetary value of this loss is difficult to calculate. Aronson recalls hearing that the company priced the combined total of lost tape and “loss of artistry” at $150 million. But in historical terms, the dimension of the catastrophe is staggering

The fire at the Universal backlot in June 2008

ec689f6ac5c2486f801eccd287d7c4e1-superJumbo.jpg

Edited by triumph

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I'm just pleased that more vinyl is being pressed, so we have more choice.

I buy quite a lot of vinyl, across all genres, 60's to present day, obscure to reasonably well known; some of it is great, some of it is poor. It is what it is. 

I also listen to the odd CD and stream a bit but, for me, vinyl is where it is at, good or bad.

Still nice to have a lot more choice.

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On 20/06/2019 at 10:26, Sgt Pepper said:

I think the thing to do is a little research, reviews, etc although for sound/pressing quality I find these very thin on the ground.

Thin on the ground would be a big understatement imo, I've never come across any.

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1 minute ago, alphatoner said:

Thin on the ground would be a big understatement imo, I've never come across any.

They are out there, but not very well done in most cases. I am surprised no one is doing this?

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