whitehart

Advantages and disadvantages of pre/power over intigrated

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Phil, the Trilogy 925 into Kudos 707 sounds rather damn good IMO.

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Super Wammer
Posted (edited)

wow , that looks lovely !!! be great to hear that !!

I see the designer was the chap behind isol 8 

Edited by hifinutt

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3 minutes ago, hifinutt said:

One might change the power amp if  getting different speakers but these shl5plus have apparently sounded  good with the e470 integrated , would it not just make sense to move to a better integrated like the accuphase E650 ? 

As I said - horses for courses.  As to better sense - I dunno if i had to have an integrated this would definitely be on my listening list https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Audio-Research-CA50-integrated-valve-amp-2-x-50-watts/264351757886?hash=item3d8c97b63e:g:tSYAAOSwyAVc2oFb

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Super Wammer
Posted (edited)

Of course more risk of having to send it for repair which the Op may not want , having an SS acuphase already . ARC stuff is great but it does need maintenance 

Edited by hifinutt
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Super Wammer

I have owned one integrated amp and had it for 15 years ....a Musical Fidelity A1000 Super Integrated Class A beast ......a two box affair in which the toroidal transformers for the Preamp and poweramp stages were held in a separate enclosures.  It sounded very good and in 1994 when I bought it new it blew away the other amp system I auditioned it against - an Audiolab Preamp and Audiolab monoblock power amps......so I'm not anti integrated amps - I've just moved in a different direction driven by the Type 26 pre that outperforms lots of kit I've encountered to date.

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Super Wammer

The op`s accuphase E470 looks absolutely lovely , take a lot to beat that i should think ! 

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having had all sorts of all types over the years, I would say it is more about the design than how many boxes it comes in. I get the valve// sold state thing having done it, but ultimatley come to the conclusion that it means you have bought the wrong amp in the first place. The multi box thing will probably appeal to the more OCD geekie ones among us. I decided I wanted less boxes, and more KISS factor. I often wonder if Naim went from Nait to pre power as a way of distinguishing themselves from the mega integrateds the Japs where turning out at the time. Dons steel helmet to suggest they couldn't do it with sound quality.

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1 minute ago, dudywoxer said:

having had all sorts of all types over the years, I would say it is more about the design than how many boxes it comes in. I get the valve// sold state thing having done it, but ultimatley come to the conclusion that it means you have bought the wrong amp in the first place. The multi box thing will probably appeal to the more OCD geekie ones among us. I decided I wanted less boxes, and more KISS factor. I often wonder if Naim went from Nait to pre power as a way of distinguishing themselves from the mega integrateds the Japs where turning out at the time. Dons steel helmet to suggest they couldn't do it with sound quality.

Mine was a mindset from the 70s where I bought a pair of Gale GS401s and could not find an integrated I liked that had the power to drive them.  So having lived with pre and power for many years (changing the pre once and never changing the amp) I just feel more comfortable - knowing if the pre amp goes I only have to change the pre (as happened when my Audionics bit the dust very sadly cos it was an awesome preamp phono stage) or if the amp goes I only have to change the amp.  It has nowt to do with geek.  However, I do appreciate that others may prefer less boxes.  As to the Naim thing - I think that was more competing with Quad and also as they developed bits they could make more dosh getting people to upgrade preamps and then power amps etc.  There is no right or wrong in this - just whatever suits you best. 

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1 hour ago, hifinutt said:

Some great points in this thread and uzzy really gives some good pragmatic reasons for pre power . having tried close to 30 plus pre amps in recent years i am leaning more to integrated and its just less space taken up, less cables and there are some tremendous integrated amps out there 

One might change the power amp if  getting different speakers but these shl5plus have apparently sounded  good with the e470 integrated , would it not just make sense to move to a better integrated like the accuphase E650 ? 

http://www.accuphase.com/model/e-650.html

***************

The 650 has crossed my mind, but I think it's class A and would end up costing me more than the pre/power

Mac

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There is no disadvantage in integrated ampliers over a separate pre power, expecially when you consider the fact that no preamp is needed unless you play records. 

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9 hours ago, whitehart said:

Are there any disadvantages apart from footprint size?  Reason I'm asking is that  have the chance to trade in my E470 for an Accuphase pre/power and a little concerned if it's the right thing to do, as I've never owned pre/power before.

Mac

Both integrated as separates have potential merits and issues.

The best way is just listen and see what you like best. Its not our ears you need to satisfy.

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2 minutes ago, Muckplaster said:

There is no disadvantage in integrated ampliers over a separate pre power, expecially when you consider the fact that no preamp is needed unless you play records. 

No one said there was a disadvantage as such - even if you play records you can get a phono preamp if integrated is your bag.. 

Us pre power preferers were just trying to list the pros and cons.  It is all a matter of personal choice at the end of the day.  Although in setting a reply it is nice to know what other wammers have in their set up.  

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1 minute ago, uzzy said:

No one said there was a disadvantage as such - even if you play records you can get a phono preamp if integrated is your bag.. 

Us pre power preferers were just trying to list the pros and cons.  It is all a matter of personal choice at the end of the day.  Although in setting a reply it is nice to know what other wammers have in their set up.  

4 channels of amplification per main speaker, 2 powered subs, 3 channels of amplification for surround. 17 interconnects, 11 speaker cables, 32 QED terminators, 9 power cables including the TV... ethernet, HDMI, SCART, optical, coax for cable, sometimes I really think I should have stuck with integrated. The amount of copper alone could buy me a small kingdom.

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Unless cost is not an issue, everything you stated about sonic signature applies equally to pre-power. 
Yes indeed but the point I was trying to make was that you can better optimise the various interfaces between source, amps, and speakers with separates, this is irrespective of cost. Whilst on that subject Accuphase, which the OP has, is not notably a low cost brand.

Sent from my BLA-L09 using Tapatalk

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5 hours ago, Psilonaught said:

Separates allow for tube preamp and solid state power. Separate power supplies in separately shielded enclosures is another benefit.

:)

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