Millennium

naim 555 ps s//h

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Posted (edited)

Labour, premises, marketing, dealer margin (40% of list price?), after sales back up, sales people to visit dealers, running a forum, leveraging 'the brand'...I would think actual cost of parts is around 1/20th.

If it's what you want...then a £4k saving is worthwhile.

Edited by savvypaul

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I remember a former mod on here had a full-on naim system (CDS-3, pre, two powers, PSUs etc) driving, of all things, a pair of Living Voice Avatars.  He improved both his sound and bank balance by replacing all the naim amps with a PrimaLuna integrated.

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Posted (edited)

I have to be honest, I like Naim equipment, I'm sure you can bring me in a number of things to dethrone parts or all of it but the damn thing just sounds fantastic listening to music, and it makes me want to listen to music. Where maybe other stuff just wouldn't.

But back to this PS its about the height (other than possibly ridiculously priced cables) of consumer electronics luxury items this. Its a power supply, it does nothing more than my system already does apart from giving it a supply of power that is better than its getting now. And 'a possible' improvement in sound, to what extent that would be is unsure, if any, and that may still be subjective.

I appreciate that what's in that little black box is years of research and development. But so is what was in this package below. It has just a prestigious name, more engineering, research and development and 'a lot' more materials to show for it. And as I said it was sold just the other day in about as good a condition as you'll ever get for less than this little black 555 box. The world is insane! Its totally unjustifiable.

32678572847_366a9bf52e_c.jpg

Edited by eddie-baby
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5 minutes ago, eddie-baby said:

I have to be honest, I like Naim equipment, I'm sure you can bring me in a number of things to dethrone parts or all of it but the damn thing just sounds fantastic listening to music, and it makes me want to listen to music. Where maybe other stuff just wouldn't.

But back to this PS its about the height (other than possibly ridiculously priced cables) of consumer electronics luxury items this. Its a power supply, it does nothing than my system already does apart from giving it a supply of power that is better than its getting now. And 'a possible' improvement in sound, to what extent that would be is unsure, if any, and that may still be subjective.

I appreciate that what's in that little black box is years of research and development. But so is what was in this package below. It has just a prestigious name, more engineering, research and development and 'a lot' more materials to show for it. And as I said it was sold just the other day in about as good a condition as you'll ever get for less than this little black 555 box. The world is insane! Its totally unjustifiable.

32678572847_366a9bf52e_c.jpg

Devil's advocate: Valid though the argument is, economies of scale matter here. How many 3-series convertibles vs how many upgraded PSUs?

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Just now, rabski said:

Devil's advocate: Valid though the argument is, economies of scale matter here. How many 3-series convertibles vs how many upgraded PSUs?

Do economies of scale mean remove your brain? Think of the resources involved.

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3 minutes ago, eddie-baby said:

Do economies of scale mean remove your brain? Think of the resources involved.

The resources are immaterial. The actual value of parts at the fundamental level constitutes only a small fraction of the actual cost of making anything. Not that I'm defending it, and you'd never, ever see me justifying that ludicrous expenditure on something that should be inherently good in the first place. It's just that you can't compare in this way.

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6 minutes ago, rabski said:

The resources are immaterial. The actual value of parts at the fundamental level constitutes only a small fraction of the actual cost of making anything. Not that I'm defending it, and you'd never, ever see me justifying that ludicrous expenditure on something that should be inherently good in the first place. It's just that you can't compare in this way. 

And that is the problem, people are so desensitised to accept this as normal, they, as you have done even give some flowery technical explanation to justify it. But people do actually support it in buying such items, I am even very tempted myself. I do fully understand what you are saying Rabski, but there is something fundamentally wrong at its core.

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Super Wammer

I only put this in because it is my belief and view not to slag off either Naim or other companies that operate this way . When you design a product which depends for its ability to work on a power supply then the original product should have the best power supply you can make. 

Under no honest circumstance should you market and sell a product which you then sell as an add on what you claim is a superior power supply .  Either make the original product the best you can or offer the original product with no power supply and let the customer choose which option they want under an extended audition and at the prices being talked about here that should be at home and in your own system . 

Sadly companies see the add on power supply as a way to get customers to buy new without getting them to upgrade the original unit and of course they tie the cusotmer to their brand as the power supply is not really designed or any use for other mfg products. 

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5 minutes ago, bencat said:

I only put this in because it is my belief and view not to slag off either Naim or other companies that operate this way . When you design a product which depends for its ability to work on a power supply then the original product should have the best power supply you can make. 

Under no honest circumstance should you market and sell a product which you then sell as an add on what you claim is a superior power supply .  Either make the original product the best you can or offer the original product with no power supply and let the customer choose which option they want under an extended audition and at the prices being talked about here that should be at home and in your own system . 

Sadly companies see the add on power supply as a way to get customers to buy new without getting them to upgrade the original unit and of course they tie the cusotmer to their brand as the power supply is not really designed or any use for other mfg products. 

Apart from how ridiculous it costs and everything other, I do see the power supply as a product in itself. Even if it was affordable it goes above and beyond what a power supply would / should be and is a niche product that the real enthusiast (should they tell and justify the difference) can buy into. The additional size of it alone would possibly make the original product less desirable should you just want that. 

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Fundamentally wrong at its core. I agree, but frankly, the vast majority of us could aim the same criticism at our systems. For about the same price as replacements for the two power output valves in my main amplifier, I paid for a new TV set for my mother and a CD player/radio, which sounds just fine. Of course it's insane, but name me any 'hobby' that doesn't apply to.

As for the other part, I have to agree with Andrew. If an upgraded power supply makes that much of an improvement, then the original isn't good enough. In light of present technology, that definitely comes under the 'fundamentally wrong' heading. A power supply really has to achieve only two things. First, to supply enough current (taking into account transients) and second, to do so with a clean waveform and no interference. Neither of these are complicated. Anyone with basic electronic knowledge can download free software to design a power supply that meets these requirements.

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, rabski said:

Fundamentally wrong at its core. I agree, but frankly, the vast majority of us could aim the same criticism at our systems. For about the same price as replacements for the two power output valves in my main amplifier, I paid for a new TV set for my mother and a CD player/radio, which sounds just fine. Of course it's insane, but name me any 'hobby' that doesn't apply to.

Oh no, I knew this was the wrong place to talk about ethics. Damn, he's got a deal, I'll take the bloody power supply xD

Its a daft hobby this, but I'm an addict. As I said, it is a hot topic for debate that one.

Edited by eddie-baby

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Posted (edited)
43 minutes ago, eddie-baby said:

Oh no, I knew this was the wrong place to talk about ethics. Damn, he's got a deal, I'll take the bloody power supply xD

Its a daft hobby this, but I'm an addict. As I said, it is a hot topic for debate that one.

I am not a NAIM fan. I was browsing the classifieds and thought I would post this. When I pulled up the picture to reply with ,I was shock ed at how little there was to[o] it.

My Primare has at least as good components.A 30.1 :

primare 18092534_6.jpg

primare a30.1.jpgI have one fuse left to swap outed.

Edited by Millennium

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28 minutes ago, Millennium said:

I am not a NAIM fan. I was browsing the classifieds and thought I would post this. When I pulled up the picture to reply with ,I was shock ed at how little there was to[o] it.

My Primare has at least as good components.A 30.1 :

primare 18092534_6.jpg

Oh no it hasn't !

46706711265_b8c549ec20_c.jpg

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11 minutes ago, eddie-baby said:

Oh no it hasn't !

46706711265_b8c549ec20_c.jpg

That's a 'tri-mare'...

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2 minutes ago, rabski said:

That's a 'tri-mare'...

I like it Rabski xD

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