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The Chronicals

Bottom Ported Speakers in a Flat?

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14 hours ago, Nopiano said:

Are you thinking that because they are ported at the bottom they will interact more with the floor?  If so, I think that’s largely a myth, because at bass frequencies the speakers typically radiate omnidirectionally.  

I'd had a similar thought. I'm not sure what frequency range may actually radiate from the port though? This might be over the full frequency range of the drivers connected to it? 

Above there were some posts about 'isolation' type supports, which as sold are claimed to offer benefits in terms of decoupling or damping floor vibrations from the speaker cabinet, and cabinet vibrations from the floor. This is an entirely different topic to anything related to having a bass port on the bottom of a speaker. I am though very sceptical about the benefit of any attempts at vibration isolation. I did some very quick tests in the following thread (which includes a link to some far better tests by Ethan Winer) but I couldn't see an obvious benefit to the measured acoustic output. (If it only affects the lowest frequencies I wouldn't have been able to detect it though).

If anyone ever demos vibration isolation products what I will though say is that changing the speaker height very definitely can change the sound at a listening position, and so if a change is heard don't assume it is necessarily due to any form of isolation. My own speakers are currently sitting on 13 cm high platforms made from a combination of granite (chopping boards!) and Auralex Platfoam but this is purely because based on microphone measurements I wanted the height change (which just puts the tweeters at ear height for me. (Keeping the microphone at the same height vs the tweeter there is no obvious difference between the speaker being on the base or on the floor.)

Edited by MartinC

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8 minutes ago, MartinC said:

I'd had a similar thought. I'm not sure what frequency range may actually radiate from the port though? This might be over the full frequency range of the drivers connected to it? 

Above there were some posts about 'isolation' type supports, which as sold are claimed to offer benefits in terms of decoupling or damping floor vibrations from the speaker cabinet, and cabinet vibrations from the floor. This is an entirely different topic to anything related to having a bass port on the bottom of a speaker. I am though very sceptical about the benefit of any attempts at vibration isolation. I did some very quick tests in the following thread (which includes a link to some far better tests by Ethan Winer) but I couldn't see an obvious benefit to the measured acoustic output. 

Yes, that’s why I asked the question, was it worries about the port.  Thanks for your detailed thoughts. 

Any speaker with a fairly generous bass output isn’t ideal for a flat, mostly because of the neighbours, regardless of design.  It would help if we knew what speakers we are talking about as some, like ProAc fire the port into an integral stand, while others open directly to the floor. 

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7 minutes ago, Nopiano said:

Yes, that’s why I asked the question, was it worries about the port.  Thanks for your detailed thoughts. 

Any speaker with a fairly generous bass output isn’t ideal for a flat, mostly because of the neighbours, regardless of design.  It would help if we knew what speakers we are talking about as some, like ProAc fire the port into an integral stand, while others open directly to the floor. 

I've lived in a fair few flats in my time and even with some pretty bandwidth limited AVI Pro-Nine loudspeakers I could listen at nothing like the volume I wanted to. In one flat I had a neighbour complain very early on that I must be playing music extremely loud as she could hear all the words. This was to some extent a compliment to my HiFi I guess but from then on I only ever properly listened to music when I knew my neighbour was out.

Modern flats have better sound insulation, but it's still going to be far from ideal. In many ways the best upgrade I ever got for my HiFi was a detached house to put it in. This was also the most expensive upgrade of course!

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Thanks for the extra thoughts fellas

Sadly isolation devices arent suitable for the speakers as they have their own inbuilt feet - Zingali Zero Sei's.

Also, getting a small detatched house would be around £1.5-2 million in my area, so sadly, not possible :)

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These Townshend Isolation platforms seem to be the obvious answer to your problem and you won't have to remove your spikes .

I intend to try a pair sometime but not because I have any problems just because I want an upgrade to the sound quality .

The second video if more informative.

http://www.townshendaudio.com/hi-fi-home-cinema-equipment-vibration-isolation/hi-fi-home-cinema-vibration-isolation-speaker-podiums/

Edited by Electro
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25 minutes ago, Electro said:

These Townshend Isolation platforms seem to be the obvious answer to your problem and you won't have to remove your spikes .

I intend to try a pair sometime but not because I have any problems just because I want an upgrade to the sound quality .

The second video if more informative.

http://www.townshendaudio.com/hi-fi-home-cinema-equipment-vibration-isolation/hi-fi-home-cinema-vibration-isolation-speaker-podiums/

I am sure they would work really nice and definitely a good suggestion to cure the problem it it occurs, but at £2800 for a pair of the smallest ones, Max can keep his podiums and sit on them while eating his caviar on his yacht!

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57 minutes ago, The Chronicals said:

Thanks for the extra thoughts fellas

Sadly isolation devices arent suitable for the speakers as they have their own inbuilt feet - Zingali Zero Sei's.

Wow, they look so cool they’re bound to sound terrific!

Do post some pics when you get them. What colour have you chosen?

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13 minutes ago, The Chronicals said:

I am sure they would work really nice and definitely a good suggestion to cure the problem it it occurs, but at £2800 for a pair of the smallest ones, Max can keep his podiums and sit on them while eating his caviar on his yacht!

I do think they are just a touch on the expensive side :D.

If I ever do buy a pair they will probably be second hand it depends on how effective they are.

Eight of these would be cheaper and make you own platform

http://www.audioaffair.co.uk/townshend-seismic-isolation-pod?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI5ou2hdmu4AIV77ftCh10eAG6EAQYAyABEgK-HfD_BwE

Or these .

https://mcru.co.uk/product/townshend-audio-seismic-isolation-bars/?v=79cba1185463

The way to look at it is if they cure the problem then it turns you system from an expensive ornament into a usable source of musical pleasure .:)

Edited by Electro

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7 minutes ago, Nopiano said:

Wow, they look so cool they’re bound to sound terrific!

Do post some pics when you get them. What colour have you chosen?

I havent made the decision...yet...but the colour would be satin black with a cherry red horn..or the walnut/orange horn.

The standmounts sound pretty epic

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5 minutes ago, Electro said:

I do think they are just a touch on the expensive side :D.

If I ever do buy a pair they will probably be second hand it depends on how effective they are.

Eight of these would be cheaper and make you own platform

http://www.audioaffair.co.uk/townshend-seismic-isolation-pod?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI5ou2hdmu4AIV77ftCh10eAG6EAQYAyABEgK-HfD_BwE

Or these .

https://mcru.co.uk/product/townshend-audio-seismic-isolation-bars/?v=79cba1185463

I think I'd rather just choose a different speaker if it was a real problem before investing in that overpriced metal! Even if it was ideal, the working class pains of spending that much on that would never allow me to actually do it, even if i could afford it on top of the speakers!

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10 minutes ago, The Chronicals said:

I think I'd rather just choose a different speaker if it was a real problem before investing in that overpriced metal! Even if it was ideal, the working class pains of spending that much on that would never allow me to actually do it, even if i could afford it on top of the speakers!

I suspect the downward firing port it not the main cause of the problem and will be just the same with a conventional speaker with forward firing ports.

It's the interaction of the low frequency vibration with the floor that needs eliminating to cure the problem .

Good luck with your quest I hope you get it sorted .

Edited by Electro

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21 minutes ago, Electro said:

I suspect the downward firing woofer it not the main cause of the problem and will be just the same with a conventional speaker with forward firing cones.

It's the interaction of the low frequency vibration with the floor that needs eliminating to cure the problem .

Good luck with your quest I hope you get it sorted .

Thanks dude, that gives me a better feeling about taking a chance with them :) 

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2 hours ago, Electro said:

I do think they are just a touch on the expensive side :D.

If I ever do buy a pair they will probably be second hand it depends on how effective they are.

Eight of these would be cheaper and make you own platform

http://www.audioaffair.co.uk/townshend-seismic-isolation-pod?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI5ou2hdmu4AIV77ftCh10eAG6EAQYAyABEgK-HfD_BwE

Or these .

https://mcru.co.uk/product/townshend-audio-seismic-isolation-bars/?v=79cba1185463

The way to look at it is if they cure the problem then it turns you system from an expensive ornament into a usable source of musical pleasure .:)

Sorbothane feat are cheap if you want to experiment with anything (but you need to buy a specific size depending on the weight of the speakers to work properly). Do have a read of the thread I linked to above if you haven't already, particularly the link in the first post but also the rest of the thread for other people's comments.

(Personally right now I need a large amount of convincing that the Townshend products wouldn't be a tremendous waste of anyone's money.)

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3 hours ago, The Chronicals said:

I havent made the decision...yet...but the colour would be satin black with a cherry red horn..or the walnut/orange horn.

The standmounts sound pretty epic

Are you saying you've heard these somewhere, rather than just in this video? Was it in a similar sized room to yours?

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19 minutes ago, MartinC said:

Sorbothane feat are cheap if you want to experiment with anything (but you need to buy a specific size depending on the weight of the speakers to work properly). Do have a read of the thread I linked to above if you haven't already, particularly the link in the first post but also the rest of the thread for other people's comments.

(Personally right now I need a large amount of convincing that the Townshend products wouldn't be a tremendous waste of anyone's money.)

Not possible due to the nature of the speaker itself as it does not have a flat bottom, I mentioned it earlier.

Id imagine the Townshend products would work very well in this application, but Id never part with that sort of money on a platform. 

Edited by The Chronicals

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