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newlash09

Suspended, direct drive, belt driven TT, what's the difference

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Hi all...good evening. 

I have been thinking of adding a TT to my setup for sometime now. And this might just be the year. 

But iam confused between the different types that exist. And do they sound different to each other - direct drive, belt drives and anything else that iam not aware of. :)

So far iam leaning towards the Michelle gyro SE as I love it's looks and it sits nicely in my budget. 

If it helps, I will be using a Devialet amp as both phono preamp and amp.

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It really doesn’t matter what deck you use with the phonostage and amp, cartridge more so.

regarding the differences with which type of drive TT, a lot depends on where you intend to place it.

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1 hour ago, radiant red said:

It really doesn’t matter what deck you use with the phonostage and amp, cartridge more so.

regarding the differences with which type of drive TT, a lot depends on where you intend to place it.

Thanks radiant...

It will be placed on hard floor directly. And will be using a Devialet with it, as it has a inbuilt phono preamp too. I guess the Devialet accommodates both MM & MC as well. But I will be going for a MM mostly as it is likely to be cheaper. And since vinyl will never be my primary source, don't want to spend too much on it :)

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Turntables sound different - the problem is determining why. 

No one who makes a non suspended subchassis deck would want you to try the seismic app on your iphone to check the vibrations getting through to the turntable platter.   Some attribute the difference in sound to the type of drive but IMO that is a load of fairy tails because if the turntable is turning at an accurate correct speed then that is it - no pitch fluctuations etc.   

A lot of illogical reasoning is given as to why suspended subchassis  or belt drives etc. are worse most of which has no scientific or measurable proof.

My preference over the years is for subchassis types with a Pink Triangle type (stretch spring not compressed) type of suspension as they are more stable and bounce perfectly (they do not wobble).  However, there are some mighty fine non suspended turntables too.   

The thing that is probably most amusing is, the improvement in sound between a Systemdek 11x or a Thorens TD150/160,  Arisron RD series, Goldring (GL75/85 etc)  and a turntable costing ten times more is IMO marginal and unless you are going to seriously invest in the arm and cartridge and phono stage to use with it you are probably better off with these variants compared to more expensive counterparts.   

In my findings I prefer a turntable with a very heavy platter which provides more weight to the bass (IMO) then after that is down to type of mat to determine the mid and top end response but generally Acrylic works well.  Others have a different view.

As with anything you listen to - you need to get your ears around a few to make your mind up which works best for you. 

Edited by uzzy
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21 hours ago, newlash09 said:

Hi all...good evening. 

I have been thinking of adding a TT to my setup for sometime now. And this might just be the year. 

But iam confused between the different types that exist. And do they sound different to each other - direct drive, belt drives and anything else that iam not aware of. :)

So far iam leaning towards the Michelle gyro SE as I love it's looks and it sits nicely in my budget. 

If it helps, I will be using a Devialet amp as both phono preamp and amp.

Maybe get some bake offs or some shop demos is your best bet- good luck and enjoy.:)

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18 hours ago, newlash09 said:

Thanks radiant...

It will be placed on hard floor directly. And will be using a Devialet with it, as it has a inbuilt phono preamp too. I guess the Devialet accommodates both MM & MC as well. But I will be going for a MM mostly as it is likely to be cheaper. And since vinyl will never be my primary source, don't want to spend too much on it :)

Hi,
Is the floor a suspended wood/chipboard type or concrete? As said, many or most turntables can be a bit fussy about where they're sited.
A TT sitting directly on a wooden floor won't be too happy - some form of isolation is a good idea & a wall shelf is often best.:)

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Your leaning towards a Gyrodec is not far wrong. It is a lovely deck, both sonically & visually. I would buy one without hesitation if it was within budget. It's great as it is, but can be upgraded in the future with different arms or cartridges. But that's for the future.

As for your question about the different tech designs, plusses & minuses of belt vs direct drive, suspension, etc etc. As others have said, where it sits is important. You say directly on a hard floor? No table or shelf at all? Thats a bit unusual.

In the very basics, a direct drive has the motor directly attached to the turntable. DJ's like DD's as the torque is pretty immediate & gets the record spinning up to speed very quickly. The potential downside to this is that unless the engineering is very good, (and good solid engineering costs) there is a chance that any motor noise or rumble can be transmitted through the turntable. .

Belt drive separates the motor from the turntable & has a rubber band or belt running from the motor, around either the platter or a spindle. The Gyro is an example of this way of doing things.

Its is always a good idea to isolate the turntable, & cartridge from any spurious noises or vibrations. This argument also extends to the question of where the turntable will be situated. A wall shelf isolates it from any footfall vibrations which can be problematic, especially if you have wooden floorboards in older houses. Maybe not so much of an issue with modern houses with solid concrete floors.

If you got a dozen turntable designers in a room, asked them to design their ultimate turntable, you would end up with 12 different results, & each of the designers would argue why theirs is better than the others.

Edited by manicatel
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Thanks a lot manicatel for breaking it down for me. I now understand the basic differences between direct drive vs belt driven . Yeah seems logical enough. 

I was planning on putting it on my hard concrete floor, as I listen with my door closed and no one walks in. And I will also be seated in a sofa and off the floor. However if the speakers are going to send vibrations up into the TT, then I will have to think of a shelf or wall suspension for it .

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https://www.henleyaudio.co.uk/products/WMI1?DepartmentIds=1&CategoryIds=47&BrandIds=2

It sits on four adjustable spikes so you can get the platform perfectly level (with a spirit level).

No need to spend a fortune.

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1 minute ago, chebby said:

https://www.henleyaudio.co.uk/products/WMI1?DepartmentIds=1&CategoryIds=47&BrandIds=2

It sits on four adjustable spikes so you can get the platform perfectly level (with a spirit level).

No need to spend a fortune.

That looks perfect for me :)

Thanks a lot chebby 

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A wall shelf or dedicated rack/stand would be preferable. No need to go over the top but it makes it easier to use.

Ikea LACK coffee table is still a goodun

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3 minutes ago, ovlov854 said:

A wall shelf or dedicated rack/stand would be preferable. No need to go over the top but it makes it easier to use.

Ikea LACK coffee table is still a goodun

Depending on weight Frank. Don't expect too much from LACK and you won't be disappointed. But a heavy deck will bend it like spaghetti. I know this :D

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8 hours ago, Von Krolock said:

Hi,
Is the floor a suspended wood/chipboard type or concrete? As said, many or most turntables can be a bit fussy about where they're sited.
A TT sitting directly on a wooden floor won't be too happy - some form of isolation is a good idea & a wall shelf is often best.:)

regardless of type of turntable IMO a shelf mount system (with the shelf directly attached to the wall) is the ideal.  Even if you have solid floors a tall unit will have movement if nudged .. whereas a wall shelf takes one hell of a bang to get any movement at all.  Although I have to say on one set up in the mid 70s the turntable stand was a peach - he had suspended floors and had cut the floor boards and built up a plinth from the ground (very nice brickwork) to stand his turntable on - and had done the same each side of the room to provide a solid support for his loudspeakers. 

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I've got one of these, about to come out of its box now I have a phono stage on my new Amp. Fitted with Ortofon 2M black MM cartridge.

I'm afraid I was seduced by its sexy ice cold minimalism and it sounds great, but i'm not sure how it compares on SQ with the equivalent Rega (eg RP6) or a sh Linn or Thorens suspended design.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=project+rpm+5+carbon+you+tube&view=detail&mid=B988005BA963ADA07815B988005BA963ADA07815&FORM=VIRE

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