Andywilliams

Where's your sofa

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Hi was wondering how many 2 channel users have there sofas on the back wall in there listening rooms reason I am asking is I am I've been told it could be the reason I suffer from bass bloom with certain speakers. My room measures 16ft x12ft x8ft ceilings  my speakers fire from the narrow end to the sofa at the back wall my speakers themselves are 2ft from both side and back walls so plenty of room round them with nothing in front of them bar the sofa at the moment I have Atc scm 11s these sound great no issues at all with boomy bass which really is my main hate when listening to music. Anyway I've owned Dali floorstanders front ported suffered bass problems also tried PMC 25-23s these where also overblown with the bass I would like to upgrade my speakers in the near future but know I will have to try them first in my room before committing the bass problems really putting me off though. Have seen quite a few pictures of folks set ups in smaller cluttered rooms than mine with sofas on the back wall with great big floorstanders not fair lol.ps can't move the sofa forwards as its a massive corner jobby.

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8 minutes ago, Andywilliams said:

Hi was wondering how many 2 channel users have there sofas on the back wall in there listening rooms reason I am asking is I am I've been told it could be the reason I suffer from bass bloom with certain speakers. My room measures 16ft x12ft x8ft ceilings  my speakers fire from the narrow end to the sofa at the back wall my speakers themselves are 2ft from both side and back walls so plenty of room round them with nothing in front of them bar the sofa at the moment I have Atc scm 11s these sound great no issues at all with boomy bass which really is my main hate when listening to music. Anyway I've owned Dali floorstanders front ported suffered bass problems also tried PMC 25-23s these where also overblown with the bass I would like to upgrade my speakers in the near future but know I will have to try them first in my room before committing the bass problems really putting me off though. Have seen quite a few pictures of folks set ups in smaller cluttered rooms than mine with sofas on the back wall with great big floorstanders not fair lol.ps can't move the sofa forwards as its a massive corner jobby.

Hi Andy...I use a 5.2.4 atmos system with front floor standing speakers in 17x11 ft room with my sofa pushed up on the opposite wall. I tried toying with placement of speakers to improve my sound but with little effect. I didnt have bass boom, but it was the feeling of the ears getting over pressurised with the bass. It was intolerable.

The biggest improvement I made, was by adding a sub for everything below 80hz. And with the sub kept in the front,  I had pretty much the same effect. So I have now shifted the sub next to my sofa. And now my bass pressurisation problems are completely gone. 

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With those dimensions you'll have main room modes at 35Hz and 47Hz, a bit below the 56Hz where your ATC speakers start tailing off, so you shouldn't be being too bothered by them.  You might be getting the hump at 70Hz though.  Room modes are always at their wost at the walls, that's why people recommend moving the sofa out.  Of course, that's often easier said than done!!

My sofa is about 25cm from the back wall, best I can manage without making things look ridiculous.

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Funny thing is I used to have a Harman kardon avr 8500 flagship amp with full Miller and kreisel 850 series speakers with dual svs sb2000 subwoofers never had overblown bass with this system but moved from detached to a semi neighbours didn't appreciate the subs so decided to go  2 channel only has I did listen to music more back then I had the xover set to 80Hz let the subs do the rest. Never thought I would have this problem.

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23 minutes ago, Andywilliams said:

Hi was wondering how many 2 channel users have there sofas on the back wall in there listening rooms reason I am asking is I am I've been told it could be the reason I suffer from bass bloom with certain speakers. My room measures 16ft x12ft x8ft ceilings  my speakers fire from the narrow end to the sofa at the back wall my speakers themselves are 2ft from both side and back walls so plenty of room round them with nothing in front of them bar the sofa at the moment I have Atc scm 11s these sound great no issues at all with boomy bass which really is my main hate when listening to music. Anyway I've owned Dali floorstanders front ported suffered bass problems also tried PMC 25-23s these where also overblown with the bass I would like to upgrade my speakers in the near future but know I will have to try them first in my room before committing the bass problems really putting me off though. Have seen quite a few pictures of folks set ups in smaller cluttered rooms than mine with sofas on the back wall with great big floorstanders not fair lol.ps can't move the sofa forwards as its a massive corner jobby.

Got a room 16' x 14' with the sofa on the back wall.  Using PMC Twenty 23s and no problem with bass bloom.  Sounds like standmounts are more suited to your room?  The thing about using a subwoofer is you can move it to any position in the room. So maybe standmounts + a subwoofer may work?

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May be if I try some more floorstanders with my hegel 190 amp back then I was using a Arcam A39 integrated see if its still the same.

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Super Dealer

Choose the speakers you really want, measure acoustically and fix any issues with a touch of EQ.

As has already been stated, ‘boomy’ bass is not a fault solely of your speakers but of their interaction with the room.

Eq can be found in playback software, DACs and even speakers themselves.

Keith

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9 minutes ago, Andywilliams said:

May be if I try some more floorstanders with my hegel 190 amp back then I was using a Arcam A39 integrated see if its still the same.

Well you can give it a shot. Some on this forum believe that bass boom happens due to the amp not properly controlling the drivers. Others believe it is a room + speaker interaction . While some distinguished friends of mine believe it is because of power cables :D

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4 minutes ago, Andywilliams said:

May be if I try some more floorstanders with my hegel 190 amp back then I was using a Arcam A39 integrated see if its still the same.

Considered buying the Hegel Amp last year, bought a Denon PMA2500NE.  One thing to look at Andy is the Amp's damping factor.  Think the Arcam A39 isn't too good in that department.  Check on the Hegel's ability when it comes to damping.  The higher the figure the better.  Could be the Arcam Amp was causing the problem.  With speakers the Amp must be able to tell them to stop as well as go.

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4 minutes ago, Ron Hilditch said:

Considered buying the Hegel Amp last year, bought a Denon PMA2500NE.  One thing to look at Andy is the Amp's damping factor.  Think the Arcam A39 isn't too good in that department.  Check on the Hegel's ability when it comes to damping.  The higher the figure the better.  Could be the Arcam Amp was causing the problem.  With speakers the Amp must be able to tell them to stop as well as go.

The reason I changed the Arcam for the Hegel h190 was I thought with the Hegels  massive damping factor it would drive the atcs better which are a difficult speaker load I do enjoy listening to my system the Hegel was a good upgrade I suppose sometimes it makes you wonder if your happy why meddle but you always get that itch 😃.

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Not saying what wears our Sofa.:oops:

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Super Dealer

The amps ‘damping factor’ is in series with the speakers impedance so not really a factor, you do need an amp whose output ( almost) doubles as speaker impedance halves, one that will drive speakers with low impedance .

But the boom isn’t anything to do with amps and everything to do with the physical dimesions of your room.

Keith

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4 minutes ago, Andywilliams said:

The reason I changed the Arcam for the Hegel h190 was I thought with the Hegels  massive damping factor it would drive the atcs better which are a difficult speaker load I do enjoy listening to my system the Hegel was a good upgrade I suppose sometimes it makes you wonder if your happy why meddle but you always get that itch 😃.

Tell me about the itch!  Sometimes it works, then there is the other side to it.

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2 minutes ago, PuritéAudio said:

The amps ‘damping factor’ is in series with the speakers impedance so not really a factor, you do need an amp whose output ( almost) doubles as speaker impedance halves, one that will drive speakers with low impedance .

But the boom isn’t anything to do with amps and everything to do with the physical dimesions of your room.

Keith

..???????."........

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6 minutes ago, Andywilliams said:

The reason I changed the Arcam for the Hegel h190 was I thought with the Hegels  massive damping factor it would drive the atcs better which are a difficult speaker load I do enjoy listening to my system the Hegel was a good upgrade I suppose sometimes it makes you wonder if your happy why meddle but you always get that itch 😃.

I have been informed on several forums, that damping factor beyond a certain value ( I think its 200 if my memory serves me right ) is of no consequence in practise. But then they might be wrong. 

I used my pmc twenty 26 in the exact same spot in my room, driven by both my parasound halo integrated of 160W per channel, and my devialet of 190W per channel. But it didnt take away the bass over pressurisation problems i had in my room.

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