Paulssurround

Tweaking Your Linn System For Higher Performance, Part 2, Vibration Control

Recommended Posts

Super Wammer
On 09/12/2018 at 15:14, Paulssurround said:

Great news Phino

Welcome to the silicon implants club   😉

It is fascinating what an improvement the silicon trivet can make. 

Hi Paul

I may have missed it, but wasn't there something about cutting out the magnet from the Ikea pad?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, sunbeamgls said:

Hi Paul

I may have missed it, but wasn't there something about cutting out the magnet from the Ikea pad?

Hi Sunbeam,

I have cut up dozens and dozens of Gunstigs, and they all have magnets embedded in the silicon.

Generally, I have found 2-4 small round magnets inside the Gunstigs, that were designed to stick the Gunstigs to the bottom of hot pots when taken off the stove.

I remove all of the magnets if I am placing the Gunstigs under HiFi components and speakers.  😀🎶

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,

For vibration control I use bubble wrap. It is available with different sizes of bubbles, it is cheap and comes often in vain as packaging material.
I have had good experiences with this "air suspension" for my electronics.

When I visit IKEA again I get the Gunstig for comparison...

Edited by Derkali

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have never tried bubble wrap for that purpose.

I have usually popped all the bubbles, before I get it under my HiFi equipment    🤪

i can only assume it is audiophile grade bubble wrap?  🤔

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 27/11/2018 at 18:57, Smokestack said:

Re the jumping stylus with the deck on a heavy  sideboard, on a suspended wooden floor.

This issue is rather more basic than most of the stuff discussed here. 

In sonic terms , of course the deck could  be sited on something better ...but the stylus jumping is a different issue .

This is due to the heavy  mass of the sideboard rocking  around laterally with movement of the suspended floor beneath  .

Try wedging something between the top back of the sideboard and the wall. This will restrict the movement with footfall etc to the vertical plane...which the turntable's suspension is much better able to deal with .

Good luck :D

Hey Smokey 

ok got that will try.👍

HNY😊

Edited by EbbandFlow

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Derkali said:

Hi,

For vibration control I use bubble wrap. It is available with different sizes of bubbles, it is cheap and comes often in vain as packaging material.
I have had good experiences with this "air suspension" for my electronics.

When I visit IKEA again I get the Gunstig for comparison...

I only use bubblewrap under my power strip, which lies on a separate shelf in my Quadraspire rack

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Another thing you can try on a wooden floor is round headed M8 coach bolts.  Remove your spikes and screw these in using the nut to lock them.

They will not harm the floor, and will give a different sound presentation. Try it.  

Donuk beautiful downtown York 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Time to give this ever-fascinating thread another airing.

I belong to the pre-Gunstig era of Paul's tweaks. When he came to my place, we used felt pads (the kind often called "floor protectors", that is very dense felt you stick on, for example, chair legs to protect wooden floors), because that is what I had to hand. I have bespoke furniture from Hi Fi Racks for my system, and, as the feet on Linn cases are not particularly well damped on the hardwood shelves of my racks, vibration control seemed like a useful thing to try. Paul will recall that we had a small but worthwhile improvement, of the kind described in earlier posts in this thread, with the pads placed under my KEDSM. But the most significant improvement came from the pads under my Akurate Exaktbox 10.

I have kept the pads in place, always intending to replace them with pieces of Gunstig. However, getting to my nearest IKEA involves a ferry journey in a direction I don't go all that often, so the intention has never become reality.

Today was the day of my LP12 upgrade (to be described in due course elsewhere on the forum), and my dealer (Chris of Hidden System), like the travelling peddler that he is, arrived bearing, as well as parts for my turntable, a set of Quadraspire QPlus Evo supports, which "thought it might be useful" to try in my system. Now Quadraspire is one of those companies I put in the same category as Chord (the cable people); products at the lower end of their price range may have some utility, but their top of the range stuff is above the clouds, price-wise. The Q Plus Evo supports are the lowest cost members of their range, but they still retail at £120 or so for a set of four.They consist of a metal ring surrounding compressed and laminated wood (Chris told me that it is bamboo), with a central core of what appears to be copper. This core is finished flat with a central hole at one end and with a sight circular projection at the other, giving the user alternative configurations to try. Chris and I tried them under both the KEDSM and the Exaktbox.

Do the supports work? Yes. Do they work better than the felt pads? Yes. Do they, like the pads, work better with the Exaktbox than the DSM? Undoubtedly. The sound is noticeably fuller and richer with the supports under the Exaktbox, as compared with using the felt pads. Would they work better than pieces of Gunstig? I have no idea. Would I put them under all my equipment? At £120 a pop, no way. But I did keep the set Chris brought, as I was able to do a part exchange deal with him involving a spare T-Cable.

Quadraspire themselves market the supports as giving ordinary furniture the characteristics of their hi-fi racks, whatever that may mean. But when you consider that the Evo models are the cheapest in the range, and their upmarket siblings (Advanced and Reference) are priced at £300 and £900 a set respectively, the Gunstig option, which I plan to use with my amplifiers and possibly the KEDSM, seems to have rather more going for it ... :)

David

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, DavidHB said:

Time to give this ever-fascinating thread another airing.

I belong to the pre-Gunstig era of Paul's tweaks. When he came to my place, we used felt pads (the kind often called "floor protectors", that is very dense felt you stick on, for example, chair legs to protect wooden floors), because that is what I had to hand. I have bespoke furniture from Hi Fi Racks for my system, and, as the feet on Linn cases are not particularly well damped on the hardwood shelves of my racks, vibration control seemed like a useful thing to try. Paul will recall that we had a small but worthwhile improvement, of the kind described in earlier posts in this thread, with the pads placed under my KEDSM. But the most significant improvement came from the pads under my Akurate Exaktbox 10.

I have kept the pads in place, always intending to replace them with pieces of Gunstig. However, getting to my nearest IKEA involves a ferry journey in a direction I don't go all that often, so the intention has never become reality.

Today was the day of my LP12 upgrade (to be described in due course elsewhere on the forum), and my dealer (Chris of Hidden System), like the travelling peddler that he is, arrived bearing, as well as parts for my turntable, a set of Quadraspire QPlus Evo supports, which "thought it might be useful" to try in my system. Now Quadraspire is one of those companies I put in the same category as Chord (the cable people); products at the lower end of their price range may have some utility, but their top of the range stuff is above the clouds, price-wise. The Q Plus Evo supports are the lowest cost members of their range, but they still retail at £120 or so for a set of four.They consist of a metal ring surrounding compressed and laminated wood (Chris told me that it is bamboo), with a central core of what appears to be copper. This core is finished flat with a central hole at one end and with a sight circular projection at the other, giving the user alternative configurations to try. Chris and I tried them under both the KEDSM and the Exaktbox.

Do the supports work? Yes. Do they work better than the felt pads? Yes. Do they, like the pads, work better with the Exaktbox than the DSM? Undoubtedly. The sound is noticeably fuller and richer with the supports under the Exaktbox, as compared with using the felt pads. Would they work better than pieces of Gunstig? I have no idea. Would I put them under all my equipment? At £120 a pop, no way. But I did keep the set Chris brought, as I was able to do a part exchange deal with him involving a spare T-Cable.

Quadraspire themselves market the supports as giving ordinary furniture the characteristics of their hi-fi racks, whatever that may mean. But when you consider that the Evo models are the cheapest in the range, and their upmarket siblings (Advanced and Reference) are priced at £300 and £900 a set respectively, the Gunstig option, which I plan to use with my amplifiers and possibly the KEDSM, seems to have rather more going for it ... :)

David

Thanks for sharing your latest story and adventures in HiFi David.

It certainly sounds like exciting times with Chris’s visit, and a new level of sound quality achieved.

The fascinating thing about playing around with vibration control devices, is that it is difficult to predict what the outcome will be under a particular piece of kit, until you try it.

I would want to audition the new Quadrispire QPlus, and then try them again with your felt pieces under the Quadraspire, and see if your hear an improvement.

I strongly suspect that you will hear an improvement with them combined, and the felt on the bottom of the Quadraspires?

Then I would try Gunstigs, Alone, and then place Gunstigs and Quadrispires together, with the Gunstigs on top of the Quadraspires.

Then I would try the same combination, but with the Gunstigs underneath the Quadraspires.

I would place my bet on the Gunstigs placed on top of the Quadraspires, as the better sounding combination?

Cheers

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Test track for your vibration control things! Just found this while trying to find something. The Warning about the Great Bell got me curious!

Ampleforth003.thumb.jpg.ff77460f576855dab6b5f90d6596c54d.jpg

Available on Qobuz: https://www.qobuz.com/gb-en/album/vision-of-peace-monks-of-ampleforth-abbey/5055354413223

Pleased to say my system is no worse the wear for the experience!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi

A few weeks ago, one of my friends dropped off four cut squares of Gunstig and when I later slapped them under the feet of my ADSM/3, they made a surprisingly noticeable difference (in a very good way; the bass sounded excellent). A few days later, I removed the KK/1 from my custom 'rack' (it and my KDS used to sit on a home-made sub-chassis, which was located in an Ikea Lack) and the loss of the KK's mass from the bottom of that sub-chassis noticeably degraded the bass quality (so Linn were incorrect; a preamp does vastly improve the sound of a system, even though it isn't connected to the mains supply) so now I'll have to add some mass back to the 'rack' to get it all sounding as just it was (which was really quite excellent).

Incidentally, I suspect that the Gunstig mat can be bought on-line via the Ikea site (and with it being a small item, you'd think the delivery costs might not bee too extreme) so no need to hop on a ferry to procure one. 

Bri

Edited by Briain

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Briain said:

Incidentally, I suspect that the Gunstig mat can be bought on-line via the Ikea site (and with it being a small item, you'd think the delivery costs might not bee too extreme) so no need to hop on a ferry to procure one

Thanks, Bri. You are quite right. I've now ordered a couple of Gunstigs. P&P of £3.50 on a £10 order isn't a snip, but it's a lot cheaper and easier than the ferry.

My own latest "accidental anti-vibration" change is in the opposite direction to yours. With my LP12 upgrade came the need to house a Klimax Radikal. After a bit of heart searching, I decided to stack it on the rack with my KEDSM on top. Both boxes are fitted with felt pads on their feet (the felt pads are designed for that kind of application and are probably better in the long term than pieces of Gunstig. So far, all seems well with the change, and the pair of black Klimax boxes looks quite neat. Pictures will appear in due course in the description of the upgrade (yet to be written) on the LP12 forum.

David

Edited by DavidHB

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Paulssurround said:

I would place my bet on the Gunstigs placed on top of the Quadraspires, as the better sounding combination?

Could well be. But don't forget that which way up you use the Quadraspires is also a variable. That's an awful lot of possible configurations to try ... :)

The priority for now is to get some sort of vibration control under the 3 amplifiers, which have none at all at present. As you see from my previous post, I've ordered a pair of Gunstigs.

David

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm a little surprised about this article. They try to set their loudspeakers as tight as possible and now Paul sets them to something soft. Paul that can't be right! It can only be that mistakes add up. Also electronics should stand as firm as possible. Ivor said once a transistor is also only mechanics opens and closes. Whereby the problem with electronics is bigger since the mechanical movements are very very small. Therefore also Spikes do not go there. I would be interested in what level you listen to.
Aren't there Kielers in the forum here? I wanted to visit the old Cay in Kiel anyway.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

In a few days it will be my turn to host three fairly far-flung friends on our rota to audition each others’ systems for the first time since the days of our callow-ish youth. The four of us have a lifetime of audio nirvana-chasing and although our quite infrequent get-togethers are in pursuit of real ale in authentic country pubs, not since our early days have we had listening sessions together. My three chums have broadly followed the Naim route so I’m the odd one out. But the most enlightened, obviously.

 

In anticipation, as well as selecting bottles of ales acceptable to these beer obsessives, the need for a little tweeking was nagging at me. The memory of George Clegg tightening the 3K array when I first got the 242s via eBay popped into my head. That was a tweek I could do.

 

But the point of all this is that I thought it was about time I got some Gunstig under my units. A short trip (and some excellent meat balls later) I was snipping away and fishing out magnets.

 

Fired up and with the usual doubts around the very real issue of confirmation bias, on went the usual test tracks (thanks Paulsurround.) Well, I’m amazed at the gains across the music’s audible range. Others have described the specifics. My listening last night confirmed them for me. Icing on the cake doesn’t come in pennies very often in this game.

 

The outcome of Thurday’s appraisal and appreciation is now just a little bit less in doubt. Strong cheddar rolls with onion, and some Duvel Triple Hop will do no harm to the session either.

 

Late edit: I have just realised that the 3K array bolts all needed a full quarter turn (to reach my guess at the degree of tightness needed.) As I remembered George’s insistence that it made a big difference, I can only speculate as to the relative gain of each tweek. Anyway, two tips for some perhaps. Such snippets on the old Linn Forum made it an invaluable source for me over the years. Much missed.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.